Episode 186: D&C 85 – Section 108 and 109 (Kirtland Temple Dedication)

December 9, 2017


Episode 186: D&C 85 – Section 108 and 109 (Kirtland Temple Dedication)

Lyman Sherman: “I’m part of the council of the 70! Now what?”
God/Joseph Smith: “Chillax, I haven’t figured it out yet.”

The church’s magnum opus is being dedicated! The Kirtland temple was four years in the making and had plunged Joseph Smith and Sidney Rigdon into deep, deep debt.

Drink count – 2
Patron Bonus – Marie and Bryce discuss Marie’s full church service experience
Read along with us at CompareDandC.com

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4 Comments on “Episode 186: D&C 85 – Section 108 and 109 (Kirtland Temple Dedication)”

  1. Duke of Earl Grey Says:

    Behold [drink!], the Kirtland Temple in all its glory!


    Cross Section:

    First Floor:

    This is the view of the pews from the west side Melchizedek Priesthood pulpit, facing the Aaronic Priesthood pulpit on the east side. The pew boxes were built with reversible seating to face either pulpit, depending on which priesthood officers were conducting the meeting. Below is a view of the Melchizedek pulpit.

    The pulpits are decorated with gold initials designating the priesthood offices of the men seated there, and giving a sense of their relative authority and importance.

    West Side:
    M.P.C. – Melchizedek Presiding Council (apparently referring to the First Presidency, according to BYU scholars)
    P.M.H. – Presiding Melchizedek High Priesthood (the Quorum of the Twelve, again according to the not-at-all-biased BYU folks)
    M.H.P. – Melchizedek High Priesthood
    P.E.M. – Presidency of Elders, Melchizedek

    East Side:
    B.P.A. – Bishopric Presiding, Aaronic
    P.A.P. – Presidency of Aaronic Priests
    P.T.A. – Presidency of Teachers, Aaronic
    P.D.A. – Presidency of Deacons, Aaronic

    Here’s an older photo showing the canvas partitions that could be used to divide the room.

    The Community of Christ’s home page for the Kirtland Temple includes photos of the other floors, and lists operating hours, for any interested in a tour:

    As for the dedicatory prayer itself, I don’t have a thing to say about it other than to titter with juvenile delight at the word “bosom”.


  2. Rick Hansen Says:

    One of the reasons you will see sections in the LDS Doctrine and Covenants that are not in the Community of Christ Doctrine and Covenants is because of differing views of what is considered “revelation.” During Joseph’s lifetime, those sections were not presented to the priesthood governing bodies or to the membership body as revelations and, therefore were not voted on and not included in the canon. Later in Utah, Brigham Young and others proposed that those older Joseph Smith revelations be added to the LDS canon and they were then added to the 1876 and later editions of LDS scriptures. So it is not that CofC “excluded” or “excised” them from their canon. They were never considered revelations in the first place, according to CofC.

    Exceptions to this are the section regarding baptism for the dead and the vision of Jesus by Joseph and Oliver in the Kirtland Temple on 3 Apr 1836. I believe they were once included, but later removed by a vote in a General Conference in 1970 (I think). The reasons were basically that the CofC no longer considered them as relevant in their evolving theology.

    As for the differing spellings of the word “Melchizedek:” If you look at some of the handwritten records that were made in the 1830s and 1840s, they used all kinds of different spellings. At some point after the churches split, the LDS church decided to standardize on one spelling, while the CofC decided to standardize on another spelling. I don’t know if they chose different spellings on purpose in this case, but it was not uncommon for the two churches to do things in a slightly different way just so they could differentiate themselves from the other.

    Another example of differentiation was the spelling of the name of the church. The Utah church standardized on “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,” with a hyphen and lower-case “d,” while the midwest church standardized with a capital “D” with no hyphen.


  3. Rick Hansen Says:

    I should add that Community of Christ was originally called “The (Reorganized) Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.” They changed their name to “Community of Christ” in the year 2000 to further differentiate themselves from the LDS (Utah) church.


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